Population transfer is the only actual mistake of the communists that you’ve brought up. Marxist-Leninists today agree that this was one of the biggest legitimate crimes of the USSR, though it was not done for “Russification.” Instead, population transfer happened during a time of constant turmoil and subversion, out of a sense of paranoia. Culture was still protected, and Russian culture did not replace local ethnic cultures, there was a simultaneous push for a “soviet” internationalist culture with preservation of local ethnicities and culture, even with population transfer. Still a crime, but the only actual crime you’ve brought up thus far.
As for the Falun Gong, again, they are a cult akin to Scientology, not an ethnicity, and the PRC isn’t killing them en masse, just repressing it as an anti-communist and western-funded cult. Same as the idea of Uyghur genocide, atrocity propaganda akin to claiming that there’s “white genocide” in South Africa, Christian genocide in Nigeria, or that Hamas sexually assaulted babies in Operation Al-Aqsa Flood.
You’re uncritically believing the equivalent of 5g cell towers causing brainwashing, or Bill Gates trying to microchip everyone with vaccines. You do this not because you’re incapable of seeing truth, but because you deliberately believe convenient lies.
@Cowbee well isn’t it convenient to label every inconvenient truth as “western propaganda”. Probably for you Stalins gulags are also Western propaganda? Priests from Germany were sent to Siberian prison for 10 years same as Nazi soldiers from here. Czech Germans sent on death marches.
Organ harvest happens on scale, you cannot explain the organ tourism in China and that hospitals have sometimes multiple floors of transplant surgery rooms in a culture where organ donation is not even popular.
I quite literally stated that population transfer was a clear mistake, though I corrected you on motive. The presence of soviet prisons isn’t propaganda, but very often the worst conditions are exaggerated and further made to seem the norm. The soviet prison system was actually very progressive for the time. Mary Stevenson Callcott documented it quite well in Russian Justice.
When it comes to social progressivism in general, the soviet union was among the best out of their peers, so instead we must look at who was actually repressed outside of the norm. In the USSR, it was the capitalist class, the kulaks, the fascists who were repressed. This is out of necessity for any socialist state. When it comes to working class freedoms, however, the soviet union represented a dramatic expansion. Soviet progressivism was documented quite well in Albert Syzmanski’s Human Rights in the Soviet Union.
There is no credible evidence of organ harvesting. You are doing the equivalent of looking at rising autism diagnoses and rising vaccine usage and claiming they are connected based on fabricated evidence. There’s absolutely no evidence of your fantasies of an organ harvesting operation going on in China, and you justify your views with neo-Nazi conspiracy theories.
@Cowbee there was a UN china tribunal about the organ harvesting in 2020. After many testimonies and china not showing up they concluded with certainty that there is systematic organ harvesting. For you UN is not a credible source anymore?
And what does Falun gong have to do with Neonazi conspiracies???
The UN is heavily biased, yes, but the fabricated testemonies and lies all coming from the Falun Gong itself and from anti-communist, far-right propagandists means that there is in fact no certainty on “organ harvesting.” The Falun Gong are a far-right cult, and dogmatically repeating their conspiracy theories is like claiming vaccines cause autism or 5g cell towers cause cancer. I’ve shown you multiple examples of how these are fabricated, and you keep pointing to already debunked claims.
@Cowbee Muslims in xinjiang doing “terrorist actions” like wearing head scarf and testifying in 2020 is far right too? And how do you explain only 2 week waiting time for organ tourists coming to China? Where are all these organs coming from if not from systematic harvesting?
May 22, 2014: Urumqi Attack, 39 killed, 94 injured as 2 attackers drove cars into crowds and threw explosives at buildings.
And many more. Since the de-radicalization efforts, these attacks have gone down to effectively 0.
As for why China has low wait times on organ transplants, they have an extremely effective medical system and a very high population, meaning it’s far easier to match organs for compatability than in smaller countries with worse medical systems. Again, you’re doing the thing where you look at increased vaccinations and increased autism diagnoses and assuming they are connected, a common far-right strategy.
No, people are not persecuted “for doing Muslim things.” There are not 1 million people locked up in Xinjiang either. These are common lies propogated by professional propagandist and christian nationalist Adrian Zenz. Linking Wikipedia over and over again is not a source, I have linked you direct sources over and over again debunking this. No, there are not 1 million “potential killers,” the idea that 1 million people are locked up is fabricated. Per @yogthos@lemmy.ml effort post:
The whole conspiracy theory started with a claim of millions of Uyghurs being supposedly imprisoned story is based on two highly dubious “studies.”. However, this claim is completely absurd when you stop and think about it even for a minute. That figure 1 million is repeated again and again. Let’s just look at how much space would you actually need to intern one million people.
This is a photo of Rikers Island, New York City’s biggest prison. The actual size of a facility interning ten thousand people.
According to Wikipedia, “The average daily inmate population on the island is about 10,000, although it can hold a maximum of 15,000.” Let’s assume this is a Xinjiang detention camp, holding ten to fifteen thousand people. How many of these would it take to hold one million people?
Let’s do some math:
Rikers Size
Rikers Prisoners
One Million Uyghurs Size
413.2 acres (0.645 square miles)
10,000 to 15,000
43 to 64 square miles
In reality, one million people would probably take more space; all the supposed detention camps we see are much less dense than Rikers.
For comparison, San Francisco is 47 square miles. Amsterdam is 64 square miles. You’d literally need detention camps that total the size of San Francisco or Amsterdam to intern one million Uyghurs. It’d be like looking at a map of California. There’s Los Angeles. There’s San Diego. And look, there’s San Francisco Concentration City with its one million Uyghurs.
Practically all the stories we see about China trace back to Adrian Zenz is a far right fundamentalist nutcase and not a reliable source for any sort of information. The fact that he’s the primary source for practically every article in western media demonstrates precisely what I’m talking about when I say that coverage is divorced from reality.
Along with his “mission” against China, heavenly guidance has apparently prompted Zenz to denounce homosexuality, gender equality, and the banning of physical punishment against children as threats to Christianity.
The fact that this nutcase is being paraded as a credible researcher on the subject is absolutely surreal, and it’s clear that the methodology of his “research” doesn’t pass any kind of muster when examined closely.
It’s also worth noting that there is a political angle around the narrative around Xinjiang. For example, here’s George Bush’s chief of staff openly saying that US wants to destabilize the region, and NED admitting to funding Uyghur separatism for the past 16 years on their own official Twitter page. An ex-CIA operative details US operations radicalizing and training terrorists in the region in this book. Here’s an excerpt:
It’s also worth noting that the accusations originate entirely from the west while Muslim majority countries support China, and their leaders have visited Xinjiang many times.
The whole thing is very clearly a propaganda blitz that US is cynically using to manipulate impressionable people in the west.
As for the medical system, again, your line of logic is akin to saying there’s no way we can diagnose autism at better degrees of accuracy without artificially inflating it. This is absurd, and the fact that you lack any and all credible evidence further points to this blatant orientalism on your part.
Population transfer is the only actual mistake of the communists that you’ve brought up. Marxist-Leninists today agree that this was one of the biggest legitimate crimes of the USSR, though it was not done for “Russification.” Instead, population transfer happened during a time of constant turmoil and subversion, out of a sense of paranoia. Culture was still protected, and Russian culture did not replace local ethnic cultures, there was a simultaneous push for a “soviet” internationalist culture with preservation of local ethnicities and culture, even with population transfer. Still a crime, but the only actual crime you’ve brought up thus far.
As for the Falun Gong, again, they are a cult akin to Scientology, not an ethnicity, and the PRC isn’t killing them en masse, just repressing it as an anti-communist and western-funded cult. Same as the idea of Uyghur genocide, atrocity propaganda akin to claiming that there’s “white genocide” in South Africa, Christian genocide in Nigeria, or that Hamas sexually assaulted babies in Operation Al-Aqsa Flood.
A hospital supposedly claimed to be for “organ harvesting” with 6000 Falun Gong members was visited by US officials, finding it to be a regular hospital, and this document leaked by Wikileaks and intentionally hidden by the US gov
The claims all come from the self-appointed “China Tribunal,” run by a British barrister that has historically prosecuted socialist countries
The sources for the claims are the Falun Gong itself, akin to saying Scientologists reporting on far-right conspiracy theories are trustworthy
The Falun Gong claims “race-mixing severs connection to the gods”
The Falun Gong believes modern science was created by aliens to take over human bodies
You’re uncritically believing the equivalent of 5g cell towers causing brainwashing, or Bill Gates trying to microchip everyone with vaccines. You do this not because you’re incapable of seeing truth, but because you deliberately believe convenient lies.
@Cowbee well isn’t it convenient to label every inconvenient truth as “western propaganda”. Probably for you Stalins gulags are also Western propaganda? Priests from Germany were sent to Siberian prison for 10 years same as Nazi soldiers from here. Czech Germans sent on death marches.
Organ harvest happens on scale, you cannot explain the organ tourism in China and that hospitals have sometimes multiple floors of transplant surgery rooms in a culture where organ donation is not even popular.
I quite literally stated that population transfer was a clear mistake, though I corrected you on motive. The presence of soviet prisons isn’t propaganda, but very often the worst conditions are exaggerated and further made to seem the norm. The soviet prison system was actually very progressive for the time. Mary Stevenson Callcott documented it quite well in Russian Justice.
When it comes to social progressivism in general, the soviet union was among the best out of their peers, so instead we must look at who was actually repressed outside of the norm. In the USSR, it was the capitalist class, the kulaks, the fascists who were repressed. This is out of necessity for any socialist state. When it comes to working class freedoms, however, the soviet union represented a dramatic expansion. Soviet progressivism was documented quite well in Albert Syzmanski’s Human Rights in the Soviet Union.
There is no credible evidence of organ harvesting. You are doing the equivalent of looking at rising autism diagnoses and rising vaccine usage and claiming they are connected based on fabricated evidence. There’s absolutely no evidence of your fantasies of an organ harvesting operation going on in China, and you justify your views with neo-Nazi conspiracy theories.
@Cowbee there was a UN china tribunal about the organ harvesting in 2020. After many testimonies and china not showing up they concluded with certainty that there is systematic organ harvesting. For you UN is not a credible source anymore?
And what does Falun gong have to do with Neonazi conspiracies???
The UN is heavily biased, yes, but the fabricated testemonies and lies all coming from the Falun Gong itself and from anti-communist, far-right propagandists means that there is in fact no certainty on “organ harvesting.” The Falun Gong are a far-right cult, and dogmatically repeating their conspiracy theories is like claiming vaccines cause autism or 5g cell towers cause cancer. I’ve shown you multiple examples of how these are fabricated, and you keep pointing to already debunked claims.
@Cowbee Muslims in xinjiang doing “terrorist actions” like wearing head scarf and testifying in 2020 is far right too? And how do you explain only 2 week waiting time for organ tourists coming to China? Where are all these organs coming from if not from systematic harvesting?
No, terrorist actions like mass stabbings. Head scarves are fine and worn commonly in Xinjiang.
July 5, 2009: The Urumqi Riots resulted in 197 deaths, and 1700 wounded in mass stabbings.
October 28, 2013: Tian’anmen Attack, 5 killed, 40 wouded, when a Jeep was driven directly into crowds.
March 1, 2014: Kunming Train Station Attack, 31 killed, 141 wounded. 8 jihadists committed mass stabbings.
May 22, 2014: Urumqi Attack, 39 killed, 94 injured as 2 attackers drove cars into crowds and threw explosives at buildings.
And many more. Since the de-radicalization efforts, these attacks have gone down to effectively 0.
As for why China has low wait times on organ transplants, they have an extremely effective medical system and a very high population, meaning it’s far easier to match organs for compatability than in smaller countries with worse medical systems. Again, you’re doing the thing where you look at increased vaccinations and increased autism diagnoses and assuming they are connected, a common far-right strategy.
Removed by mod
No, people are not persecuted “for doing Muslim things.” There are not 1 million people locked up in Xinjiang either. These are common lies propogated by professional propagandist and christian nationalist Adrian Zenz. Linking Wikipedia over and over again is not a source, I have linked you direct sources over and over again debunking this. No, there are not 1 million “potential killers,” the idea that 1 million people are locked up is fabricated. Per @yogthos@lemmy.ml effort post:
As for the medical system, again, your line of logic is akin to saying there’s no way we can diagnose autism at better degrees of accuracy without artificially inflating it. This is absurd, and the fact that you lack any and all credible evidence further points to this blatant orientalism on your part.
This is actually you doing the exact opposite: labeling every convenient piece of Western propaganda as “truth”